INTERVIEW: TREY STOKES and AMY EARHART (PINK FIVE)
Web site

interview conducting began 9/3/2003

Pink Five was a film that sort of came out of nowhere and made a lot of people laugh at once. Then the frenzy (of sorts) built, culminating in winning the top award at the second AtomFilms contest. The little film that could. It's a Hollywood ending.

Trey Stokes should be no stranger to the ups and downs of the creative process: he's a visual effects professional and he's had all sorts of adventures in the world of filmmaking, and... well... other things. This guy knows what it's like in the real world of faking things.

He and Pink Five herself, actress Amy Earhart, were kind enough to join me in an interview to discuss the film, its successes, the fan film world and all the craziness of life out in La La Land.

We start with Trey at the controls of the X-wing...

Okay—basics. Name, age, location, favorite Star Wars movie.

Trey Stokes, 43, Los Angeles. Favorite Star Wars movie? Star Wars. Yes, some call it "A New Hope" or "Episode IV", but it was "Star Wars" when I saw it and "Star Wars" it shall ever be.

We discuss why this whole Star Wars thing is so big for fan films:

Certainly Lucasfilm's tolerance—and more recently, support—has a lot to do with it But beyond that, Star Wars gives you an entire galaxy to play in—you can do a big space battle with lots of aliens, or a one-on-one fight scene with two people in bathrobes, or any of a number of other sub-genres of the whole Star Wars world. Whatever your skills and resources allow, there's probably a way to make a SW film out of it.

All you need is a forest. So what was the last really good fan film you watched?

I have to confess something - I have a 56k connection and thus haven't seen very many SW fanfilms. There, I said it. So I'll name a fanfilm you've probably never heard of. At the last 48-Hour Film Festival I attended, there was a film called Hickory, Dickory, Clockwork Orange, which was a parody of, surprise!, A Clockwork Orange. It was a brilliant concept, hysterically funny, and made in two days on a zero budget. That one may show up online soon, or at least I hope so - more people should see it.

Okay, someone out there send me a review copy! What was the last really good 'real' movie you saw or watched?

Well, I just got The Two Towers DVD and that's just a great film. Great effects, sure, but everything else about those movies is great, too. And I've never read the books, so I don't even know what's gonna happen in the next one! I'm looking forward to finding out.

Aragorn is Frodo's father. Then they ride a sled called Rosebud. So, of the fan films you have seen, what's your favorite?

I'd have to say Troops. Yes, I know that's the stock answer, but what can I tell ya, it's a great idea, it's done well, and it was a ground-breaking demonstration that the tools were becoming available for people to make these kinds of films on their own. And I admit that Pink Five is a bit of an homage to Troops, in the sense that it deals with another "story you didn't get to see".

He's got quite a few thoughts on the fan films world:

I'd like to see more stories that aren't centered around lightsaber duels. I haven't even seen Conspiracy or The Vorzyd Gambit, but I like the IDEA of those films—that they explored other elements of that world, beyond the Jedi. Well, leaving out the part that I'm personally not into Jedi-centric stories, I just like to see films that are well-made. I mean well-made in the sense that the makers put as much effort into their script and directing and sound and performance as they did on the effects. I'll happily watch a Jedi story if it's an INTERESTING story.

Fan film makers still sort of dwell in the shadows - "Here, I made this film... hope nobody gets mad at me for it..." It'd be nice if they didn't have to deal with that lingering threat of reprisal. I think eventually the Hollywood system will find a way to embrace the fan film movement - just as soon as they figure out how to make money off it.

Speaking as someone who has trouble getting his fan film into mainstream festivals, I can sympathize.

But Trey's hardly done talking...

I'm not very interested in films that are just a showcase for visual effects. Okay, you can do "bullet time" and that's nice, but what's your movie about? Granted, a lot of Hollywood films do the same thing, so fan films are hardly unusual in that respect...

Maybe it's just because visual FX is my day job, so the nuts and bolts of the process have lost their fascination for me.

Oh, cry me a river, Mr. Professional! Heh. Yes, let's reiterate: Trey has worked on big-budget feature films like The Blob, Starship Troopers and Batman Returns. It's a hell of a way to make a living, and the story of getting there is interesting, too.

I was always headed in this direction, though that's only obvious in retrospect... even when I was a very little kid, I was doing little puppet shows and making 8-mm films - a lot of plastic models were blown up with firecrackers, let me tell ya. And I was watching a lot of television. I know that worried my parents—what's the kid gonna do with his life, all he does is watch TV and blow stuff up! And I didn't really have an answer to that until Star Wars came out, and I realized this could be an actual JOB.

As far as getting into the business, it happened in rather a roundabout way - I started as a puppeteer on stage, which led to doing creature FX in movies, then to being a motion capture performer, and then to digital animation and FX supervising.

Under the banner of The Truly Dangerous Company. Where'd the name come from?

Years ago when I was working as a puppeteer, I got tired of being labeled a "children's entertainer". I wanted to do puppet theatre for grownups, stuff with more adult ideas and themes. So I wanted a company name that reflected that, and came up with "The Truly Dangerous Puppet Company". I figured with a name like that, we wouldn't be getting a lot of calls to do birthday parties. When I got into media production, I dropped the "puppet" part and we've been The Truly Dangerous Company since then. I still think The Truly Dangerous Puppet Company is a great name, though - someday I'd like to do a midnight cabaret-type stage show with that title.

But now I'm trying to get into directing [movies] as a paying job, and that's a whole different door to get one's foot into.

You've worked with, or at least met, quite a few well-known or respected (or both) film industry professionals in your travels, including The Empire Strikes Back director Irvin Kershner. What would you say is your favorite story of a brush with fame?

Hmm, there are a number of possible stories - though they're not always HAPPY stories, because some famous people are jerks. But I'll tell you a happy story... I was a huge fan of Mystery Science Theatre 3000—and how could I not be? They watch movies and do adult-oriented humor with puppets!

Makes sense.

One day I heard that Joel Hodgson, the creator and original star of MST, was in LA doing a pilot for a new TV show. I managed to get a job as a puppeteer on the show, and it was one of the best projects I ever worked on, in terms of the fun I had while doing it. The pilot itself never went anywhere, but thanks to that gig I got to know Joel and we've been friends ever since. We occasionally help with each other's projects, usually on an informal basis—hey, can you come over and take a look at this thing I'm working on, stuff like that. He's always got great ideas and is very generous about sharing them—I think he mostly just likes to play around with stuff and have fun with it. And of course he's one of the funniest people I know—I can never bring myself to delete the messages he leaves on my answering machine. So that was an especially happy ending, to be a fan of someone and then find out they're cool in real life, too.

You know what else is cool? Good segues. So what, precisely, inspired Pink Five?

Precisely? Some friends at a company called Contour Entertainment had built a demo for a video arcade sorta thing—you put on a costume, sit in front of bluescreen and read lines off a teleprompter, and the system inserts you into a popular movie and then you take home a videotape.

That sounds really fun, actually. I'd do that.

Their demo was "Top Gun", so they had a bluescreen with lights, and a flight suit and a helmet. It was just sitting there, and I thought - okay, bluescreen, flight suit, helmet... what can I do with those? Or rather with those things and Amy, because Amy's always the first call I make when I want to shoot something.

She used to be the first call I'd make, too. Then I heard from her lawyer.

So the idea of a female X-wing pilot came from that. Which brings up the embarrassing bit of trivia that the only production cost for Pink Five consisted of buying that "Chicks Rule" sticker, which I needed to cover up the "Maverick" logo on the helmet. In retrospect, had I known so many people would end up seeing our little movie, I would have also bought a "regulation" orange jumpsuit for Amy to wear... who knew?

How could you have underestimated the audience? Were you not aware of the fan films community? All us nerds?

I knew some films had been made, but didn't know there was such a thing as an online "community" of people doing it. I figured they were all made by dangerous loners like me.

Never underestimate the number of nerds out there. Speaking of things dangerous loners might do, what motivated your decision to do such an in-depth analysis of purported autopsy footage? To satisfy skeptical interests of your own, or to celebrate the power of the special-effects trade?

Wow, you've done your homework. A little of both, really. I've always been skeptical by nature, and after the "alien autopsy" thing appeared on Fox, the internet newsgroups were filled with people saying "professional FX people couldn't have done that, they're totally baffled by it". Well, I was a professional FX person, and I wasn't baffled by it, and wanted to say so. I had also just got this new thing called a "Web page"—this was quite a while ago, kids—and so I wrote up a little analysis and put it online. And the hits started coming and just never stopped—there was just this huge interest in the material that I didn't expect.

You gotta get better at predicting that sort of thing.

Over the next couple of years I added a lot more to the autopsy page, and to this day it's still the most-visited area on my website. The best part is that at first the pro-UFO folks were defending the "autopsy" like it was the Shroud of Turin—and for the same reason—but nowadays most of the UFO community has taken a big step back from the film, and I see a lot of my original arguments being quoted as their reasons for not believing in it. So that's pretty satisfying. At least it makes up for all that hate mail I got.

What do you say to people who dismiss old movies for the bad effects, or, on the flip side, whine about too much CGI in today's movies?

Well, I remember when E.T. came out, and even at the time I was less than impressed by that shuffling hunk o'rubber. And yet the film itself is so well done that even the clanky ET puppet doesn't ruin it. The new version with the upgraded ET is nice, but kinda unnecessary—it was a good film already. On the other hand—Godzilla, anyone? The big-budget Sony remake, I mean. The effects in that are frickin' spectacular, but the film is almost unwatchable.

Dude, I can't believe I was so excited for a movie that sucked so much.

So my answer is not that there's too much CGI in movies, it's just that there's often not enough movie in the CGI. (Pithy quote, eh?) Meanwhile, anyone who turns up their nose at a film just because it has "bad effects", well... I pity the fool who says Jaws is no good because the shark looks fake. Bring them before me right now, so I may smite them and say unto them "Yes, the shark in Jaws looks awful... and it's still one of the best movies made in the past thirty years. Now be gone from my sight, youngster. Go be a drone at an FX company, they have a place for your kind. But do not claim to know about film, for your senses are addled."

Now that I think about it, that would be a lot of fun to say. Could you bring me someone like that, so I can get my smiting on?

I tried, but the post office wouldn't mail him. So, again, as a visual effects professional, what do you see as the next big possible trend to shape special effects artistry and technology, now that CGI is coming into its own?

Beats me. I work in the trenches, so I don't really see those things coming. I'm usually just trying to survive whatever project I'm working on. The only trend I'm aware of is the business side—the fact that so many FX companies have folded recently, at least here in California. Just a few years ago you had Cinesite and DreamQuest and Boss Film and Centropolis, but they're all gone now, and lot of the smaller companies have gone away too. So nowadays Sony and ILM get most of the projects, then there are a few mid-sized companies like Tippett Studio who've managed to keep going, and then a lot of tiny houses that compete for the scraps. Sometimes a studio will have to delay production on a big FX movie, because there are only a few companies left and they're all booked. So FX work is being farmed out to companies outside of Hollywood, making it a tighter job market here. That's the only trend that I'm paying much attention to at the moment.

Boss did my favorite movie, Ghostbusters. I reflect on this trend for a moment on a bygone age. Then I try and lighten the mood:

What do your parents think of your hairstyle?

I think they've gotten used to it. At least they don't mention it anymore.

So, here's the question you knew you'd get. What can you tell us about the possibility of a rumored Pink Five sequel? I was hoping to see the "skiing trip".

Wellll... I've had a plan for sequels ever since our original run on IFILM.

IF we do them, there'll be two: Pink Five Strikes Back, and The Return of Pink Five.

YES! YES!

One per original film, that's the plan. Each would be another "untold story"—turns out Stacey was part of the whole saga, but somehow she got left out of the original movies. They'd all be comedies, of course, but Stacey would also grow and learn a bit over the course of the trilogy—I couldn't ask Amy to play a complete airhead for two more films! And she'd definitely be getting out of the cockpit, there'd be some actual action next time. So I think the sequels could be fun - but I should also say that right now they aren't even on the radar. I have a lot of other projects I want to get to first.

Speaking of which - if I may plug? Never mind, look who I'm talking to!

Another Trey 'n' Amy project called Land of Many Uses is due to open on AtomFilms, umm, next week I think... And we just did one recently called Fish Guys... And there's a grandiose plan to do a feature-length project - but the story for that one is so weird I won't even try to describe it, we'll just have to DO it. It's a comedy, I'll say that. With puppets. And Amy. And visual effects. So there ya go, what more could you ask for? Anyone want to fund that one? It won't cost much, I promise.

Yeah, sure. Typical producer. Okay, one last question. Imagine an interdimensional crossrip opens and Stacey can enter any other fictional universe at any pre-existing situation. Where would you want to put her?

I should let Amy take that one, I know she's kicked that idea around for fun. As I recall there was a Terminator idea - "So, are you, like, Sarah Connor or what?"—and some others... Amy?

Like, an interdimensional what?

Amy Earhart created such a convincing dumb Valley Girl in Pink Five that I'm almost disappointed to see that she's also capable of answering questions in a straightforward, intelligent, natural manner:

Okay—basics. Name, age, location, favorite Star Wars movie.

Amy Michelle Earhart, I'll be 23 October 3rd, I've lived in LA most of my life, but I'm from Texas originally. Favorite? How do you choose?

Tough question. Will George Lucas be reading this?

God willing, yes. Hey, George, if you're reading, visit the store, huh?

Let's put it this way. I'm a huge fan now, but I was a girl born the year The Empire Strikes Back was originally released in theatres, so I sort of missed the crest of the wave. Admittedly, I didn't see all three movies in their entirety till they were re-released a few years back.

Well, as long as you ended up on the right road in the end. So how did you come to be involved with Trey Stokes and the Truly Dangerous Company?

Trey and I met when he directed the Valentine's Day episode of an Internet series I was starring in.

Yeah, tell me a little bit about your acting background.

My favorite high school English teacher who was also the drama teacher threatened that if I didn't take drama he'd kill me. Ultimately, it was a decision based on personal safety.

I studied theatre for two years at the American Academy of Dramatic Arts. I did a lot of Shakespeare and Tennessee Williams. Good stuff.

No desire whatsoever to be anything but an actor right now. Drama is cool and at one point, that's really where I saw myself going, but I keep getting pushed into comedies—or maybe I keep falling into them. Regardless, I enjoy making people laugh.

I then dig down to the question I just gotta ask.

What, precisely, is your connection to aviator Amelia Earhart… and how often do you get asked that question?

Very often! She's a cousin on my father's side. There's actually only one family in the world that uses that exact spelling and it's mine!

Like Trey, Amy wasn't aware of the world of fan films until she became part of it. Reflecting on her experiences since then, she muses:

I've learned that being a Star Wars "Geek" isn't such a bad thing.

Well, that's good. 'Cause if the Stacey sequels take place, she just might end up rubbing shoulders with a few more of them.

Thanks for stopping by, you two, and for making a flick showing the best of what happens when visual effects and human performance collide.

Hey, that's my opinion.